Talk:Malbork

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POV Name?[edit]

Why exactly is it POV to say that the city, when founded, was called Marienburg? john 03:48 26 May 2003 (UTC)

It wasn't POV to say that, but the other stuff was, so I just neutralized it. The German name is there, and the links will certainly say something about it as well. It could even be made clear that it was founded around the TK fortress called Marienburg -- but shouldn't really continue on as if that's the name used today. JHK

I see nothing wrong using Malbork as the primary description for the city. However, the Teutonic Order did not build the castle Malbork- they built the castle Marienburg, and that should be the first name listed for the castle. Some posters continue to change this. Olessi 22:23, 16 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]

The city of Malbork was built around the fortress of 'Malbork' (Marienburg in German)"--Witkacy 22:30, 16 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
How about, "The city of Malbork was built around the fortress 'Malbork' (originally Marienburg in German)"? Olessi 22:50, 16 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
Fine with me. Halibutt

... and the biggest brick building south of the Alps is?[edit]

Now then, what's the biggest heap of bricks south of Alps?Halibutt 06:09, 21 Dec 2003 (UTC)

(The article said "the largest heap of bricks north of the Alps".) Well, I don't know, there are many. Maybe Castello Sforzesco, see Talk:Malbork_Castle#World.27s_largest. --Nemo 12:49, 19 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]
The "largest" was added in January 2006 by Edvard3. --Nemo 13:05, 19 July 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Alternative images[edit]

File:Zamek krzyzacki w Malborku.jpg
Teutonic Knights Castle in Malbork (Marienburg)

On adding the panorama of the castle, I figured there wasn't enough text to support the older drawing, so I'm moving it here for later use. -- Solipsist 14:09, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Ordensburg Marienburg[edit]

As the new article Ordensburg Marienburg covers the castle and its history, this article here should focus on the present day city (and maybe the history of the city, if different from the castle). --Matthead 09:23, 9 June 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Records of Inhabitants of Marienburg before 1945[edit]

The records of all inhabitants from about 1580- before 1945 are filmed and can be seen at LDS Family History Centers: Marienburg — Preceding unsigned comment added by 70.133.64.78 (talk) 22:55, 16 February 2008

In addition, the splendid archives of the Teutonic Order are essential research. They are now in Vienna.109.151.159.105 (talk) 16:23, 4 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Malborg[edit]

The City is written Malborg on all pre 1930-Polish Postcards I have access to and also here. Anyone in Poland with a clue? Shouldn´t this old spelling also be in the article? --134.93.60.170 (talk) 00:01, 22 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

All the place names on the paper are in Polish. That is probably because that was the paper given to the Polish government. Presumably if you saw the one handed to the German government it would be in German.(83.13.39.98 (talk) 20:51, 18 May 2008 (UTC))[reply]

Murdered?[edit]

Is it correct to say the mayor of the town was "murdered"? Was he killed without trial? Is it POV to decide whether it was judicial or murder? (83.13.39.98 (talk) 20:51, 18 May 2008 (UTC))[reply]

What kind of trial would that have been? "Do you plead guilty or not guilty?" - "I defended my home town against a foreign army and do not feel guilty for that." - "Whatever, you are guilty of being the foreigner around here now." -- Matthead  Discuß   13:57, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Source of those statements please. --Molobo (talk) 02:44, 11 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

also murdered[edit]

I'm no proper writer, so maybe one of you feels like incorporating this into the article: http://www.spiegel.de/international/europe/0,1518,600216,00.html remains of 1,800 people found in ww2 mass grave in Malbork - believed to be former german residents.. 88.68.251.20 (talk) 10:34, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Done. -- Matthead  Discuß   13:57, 10 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

First of all just before the Red Army's advance Nazi's often murdered all Poles and Jews they could find-it is unfortunately a known fact of the last stages of the ending the war. Thus we don't know the identity of those people. Also I clarified the sensantionalist news reports, the initial investigations and reports show that those bodies are victims of infighting and freezing temperatures of thoese who decided to stay in the city.Explained the lack of clothes.--Molobo (talk) 02:42, 11 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

This kind of here-say without credible sources is outrageous. I spoke with the Municipal authorities in September 2018 and they confirmed that the bodies found were German civilians. Interestingly they said the forensic evidence was able to pinpoint that because Slavs had different jaws!109.151.159.105 (talk) 16:31, 4 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The Malbork article's wording on this subject says that the 1,800 individuals were killed by the Red Army. While that is a reasonable conjecture based on widespread evidence of the WWII Red Army, there is nothing conclusive to indicate that the Red Army was responsible for all 1,800 deaths. (See: http://uk.reuters.com/article/latestCrisis/idUKLE459966) The excavations and forensic analysis have not progressed to the point of identifying who or what killed the 1,800. Until further information is available, I suggest rewording so that the Red Army's role in the deaths is not definitive. Kawkawpa (talk) 14:27, 20 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Another outrageous joke post.109.151.159.105 (talk) 16:31, 4 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

There are reasonable doubts if it was really the Red Army or one of the Polish death brigdaes (like: Wyleska Brygada), and number is around 2000, not 1.800. And the Danzig Institute for Historic memory (IPN) attitude forward the fact corroborates that it were most likely a Polish death brigade instead of the Red Army ---> http://www.news4press.com/Polen-Zeuge-zum-Marienburger-Massengrab_422781.html in German. - PHWEBERBAUER. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 201.79.31.92 (talk) 17:57, 20 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

  • There are no evidence about very existence of Polish death brigades. There is evidence about muss murders committed by Red Army. Cautious (talk) 16:18, 25 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]
Another joke post. Try reading books such as The Hour of the Women by Count Christian von Krokow.109.151.159.105 (talk) 16:31, 4 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

No post-AK partizan unit was tolerated by the Soviets - imprisoned in camps, sent to SU, killed. German sources suggest Polnische Banditen - old German custom. No Polish gang could have dug a grave for 2000 bodies and no criminals would have cared about the bodies. There existed high criminality among Poles in 1945 as the result of German cultural impact 1939-1945, but the Soviets ruled.Xx236 (talk) 14:57, 31 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

More garbage. Polish brigades and militias' conduct has been testified to by thousands of interviewees.109.151.159.105 (talk) 16:31, 4 February 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Why does the article state :" most likely not murdered" and then references a description of the mass grave that leaves no other logical possibility???. I realize it is emotionally important to a lot of people to white wash their history , but come on... palmerwmd ----

Sorry but like in Swinemünde it was the Communist Polish state which murdered and not bandits and it is not Malbork alone their are hundreds of such places in Poland. JB. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 212.39.84.178 (talk) 16:05, 8 June 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Swedish text[edit]

The AP article contains information about lack of teeth. Do we need a Swedish language text about the same? If yes - can someone explain, what the article says?Xx236 (talk) 14:47, 31 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Cleaned up[edit]

I cleaned up a bit of the sensationalist reports about the supposed German mass grave, which turned out to be mostly wrong per results of investigation. I think we can shortened it furthermore-it isn't an important event in the history of city compared to the others, and uses far too much space in the text. Especially compared to the little amount of information regarding atrocities by Nazis.--MyMoloboaccount (talk) 17:17, 5 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't think any event influenced the area more than the expulsion of its populace after WWII. The fate of about 10 percent of the pre-war population is definitely important. HerkusMonte (talk) 16:57, 7 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
Please source the claim about "10% percent of pre-war population".The exact identity the bones found isn't known.Thank you to the best of my knowledge.--MyMoloboaccount (talk) 19:52, 14 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]
I added some more precise statements. The notice about ending the investigation was also very clear that very few bones had gunshot wounds Tylko na nielicznych kościach --MyMoloboaccount (talk) 20:02, 14 November 2010 (UTC)[reply]

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Are we sure Algemin is the Old Prussian name for this place?[edit]

The only citation I can find of Algemin being the Old Prussian name seems to be from a 1922 book by a guy called Georg Gerullis entitled Die altpreußische Ortsnamen (Old Prussian Place Names).

"Alyem C ı, 80; 1326 Algent S. ı, 120 (wohl aus * Algem verschrieben); um 1350 Algemin, Algemeyn 5.1, 462; so hieß die Gegend um Marienburg, Stuhm, Christburg. Grund: form nicht sicher zu erkennen."

Most of the citations from things that mention Algemin as Malbork cite this book. Do we have any more conclusive evidence and/or citations that Malbork was ever called Algemin, or is this the only basis we have for it? Pineways (talk) 18:27, 28 July 2022 (UTC)[reply]

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