Talk:Tom Maguire

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Untitled[edit]

Can somebody please tell me what this is? -- Zoe

It appears to be a statement of some sort by a member of the Continuity Irish Republican Army. As a source document, it doesn't belong in Wikipedia. If it's relevant, it can be linked to from an article at external sites such as [1]. --Brion

Can someone protect this page?Its getting destroyed by CIRA nutcases Dermo69

"Last surviving member"[edit]

Tom Maguire is often mistakingly cited as having been the last surviving member of the Second Dáil at the time of his 1969 statement and at the time of his death in 1993.

Isn't the key point that in Continuity IRA theory most of the Second Dáil expelled themselves by supporting the treaty and the southern state, either in 1922 (O'Sullivan) or later (de Valera)? And that the rump of the Second Dáil still existed until maguire died? Timrollpickering (talk) 14:52, 17 September 2008 (UTC)[reply]

There are two different things:

in 1969, he was the last surviving member of the "Executive Council of the Second Dáil", the 7 signatories of the 1938 handover. This is Timrollpickering's point.
- that doesn't explain by what mechanism authority reverted to the (surviving member(s) of) the Executive Council in 1969 to adjudicate a dispute within the organisation to which they had transferred authority 31 years earlier. But that's another issue altogether.
checking the death dates of Members of the 2nd Dáil, it looks like he was the last surviving member of the 2nd Dáil (though some dates are missing)
- somebody thought "Gerald O'Sullivan" outlived him; presumably this conflates Gearóid O'Sullivan (2nd Dáil, died 1948) with Gerry O'Sullivan (died 1994, 26th Dáil)
- Maguire's importance to legitimists derives from the 1969-last-survivor fact, not the 1993-last-survivor fact
  - but the 1993-last-survivor fact is still notable enough to mention
    - But it needs a reference: all the books seem to assert the 1969-last-survivor, though this one is ambiguous.
      - Maybe a newspaper report of his death 1993 would be sufficiently unambigous;
        or of Seán MacEntee's death in 1984, as I think MacEntee would have been the second-last survivor, so it might say "MacEntee was the last survivor of the First Dáil and second-last survivor of the Second Dáil; the sole survivor of the Second Dáil is now Tom Maguire"

jnestorius^(talk) 21:06, 24 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The confusion tends to be from a misreading of Maguire's own words, and it also depends on which statement is being referred to. The 1986 statement (the 1987 statement contains a similar phrase) is crucial for understanding the 1969 statement, and it reads "I speak as the sole surviving Teachta Dála of the Second Dáil Éireann and as the sole surviving member of the Executive of the Second Dáil Éireann". The two things are not the same. Since MacEntee death in 1984 he had become the sole surviving Teachta Dála of the Second Dáil, but in 1969 he was the sole surviving member of the Executive of the Second Dáil (which comprised the seven signatories). He never claimed to tbe sole surviving TD prior to 1986. O Fenian (talk) 08:49, 25 April 2011 (UTC)[reply]