Talk:Homosexual behavior

This article needs a new title. I will be moving it to "Gay sex" by this time tomorrow if there are no objections. The article is about nothing except sexual practices, so it should be given an article title that represents what it is about. "Behavior" is a word so broad that it could potentially include the habit of taking the bus to work, brushing one's teeth, reading the novels of Proust, etc., none of which are under the domain of this article. In addition, the word "homosexual" is considered quite clinical and old-fashioned, and "gay" is the accepted and usual term these days. Moreover, there is something vaguely homophobic about an article called "Homosexual behavior," as if there is any "behavior" exclusive to gay people. For those reasons, I plan on making the change, but I wanted to announce it here first in case someone had objections or suggestions. Moncrief 05:18, Mar 23, 2004 (UTC)

I don't think that's a good idea. so far as i know, homosexual!==gay. "gay sex" sounds like sexual activity between/among male homosexuals exclusively. and, for me, "gay sex" implies the people who do that are gay. i think homosexual behavior is broader than "gay sex". well, that's my POV as a Chinese speaker. for reference only for English speakers. --Yacht 05:31, Mar 23, 2004 (UTC)

I agree with Yacht. This article discusses sexual activity between members of the same gender, who need not necessarily be gay. Marnanel 05:49, 23 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I see your points. What is more important to me is that the broad and not very helpful word "behavior" be replaced by the specific word "sex." I do understand that "Gay" may be too specific. What about Same-sex sexual practices then? That's really exactly what this article is about. Moncrief 05:51, Mar 23, 2004 (UTC)

Sounds fine to me! Marnanel 06:03, 23 Mar 2004 (UTC)

Lesbian sex, gay sex, and this page should all be redirects. Meelar 06:04, 23 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I'm not sure what you mean? Redirects to the new title? Sounds good. "Gay sex" now merely redirects to "Homosexual behavior." I'll make sure all three redirect to the newly-titled article when it's created. Moncrief 06:08, Mar 23, 2004 (UTC)

Same-sex sexual practices? If homosexual behavior is about sex only (not include kissing etc), i am okay with that. i guess homosexual behavior is a specialized term for sexology, not sure... --Yacht 09:38, Mar 23, 2004 (UTC)

Homosexual "behavior" is not about sex only - that's why the title of the current article doesn't match the contents therein. Behavior is a very broad English word that can mean anything from one's daily habits to the way he or she interacts with the world. This article is about sex specifically. I'm not entirely sure I understand what you mean in your comment. Moncrief 09:41, Mar 23, 2004 (UTC)

well, I meant that what is sexual practice can be very different from countries to countries. in western countries, maybe making love in bed is called "sexual practice", but in other countries, even "holding hands" or "kissing" can be considered "sexual practice". so i think "behavior" is good for the title because it's more vague. also, i am just thinking "homosexual behavior" is a formal expression among sexologists. i am not sure about that. when i was thinking about this article, the first word came into my mind was "homosexual behavior". anyway, if u guys feel "Same-sex sexual practices" is more appropriate, just go ahead. after all, i am not a native speaker. ;) --Yacht 10:06, Mar 23, 2004 (UTC)

I see your point about the definitions of sexual practices varying from country to country, but the word "behavior" standing alone has no sexual, or romantic, connotations so it really doesn't fit. In fact, the words "homosexual behavior" together have a vaguely homophobic connotation - as if gay people are alien beings with distinct behaviors (not sexual behavior - just the behavior of daily life). I'm glad you were able to understand the need to change the title. Moncrief 10:29, Mar 23, 2004 (UTC)

For the record, I did not move this page to its new title. I would have been quite happy to continue the discussion another day, or longer if concerns remained. It's sort of unfortunate someone decided to move the title without engaging in the discussion here. Moncrief 09:51, Mar 23, 2004 (UTC)

My apologies. For the record, I think that there are two articles needed - "homosexual behaviour" is not limited to same-sex sexual activity: there's a whole separate article needed on homosexual/queer culture, self-image and lifestyle. (For example, consider celibate homosexuals, of which there are many). It's just that this article was entirely about sex. I'll tweak things a bit, and see if I can improve the situation. -- The Anome 10:41, 23 Mar 2004 (UTC)

I'm not sure why you changed it back now!! We were all on board with the new name. Please don't forget to change it to Same-sex sexual practices tomorrow, if you don't do it today. I don't think anyone but an admin can do it now since the page was created. By the way, there is an article on Queer culture already. Moncrief 10:46, Mar 23, 2004 (UTC)

I've left Same-sex sexual practices in place, and I've created a disambiguation page to deal with the vague term "homosexual behavior", and pointed it at some articles which are relevant. I think this is probably the best way to go. -- The Anome

I don't like this disambig page. the three topics listed here seems irrelevant. does homosexual behavior has anything to do with "queer culture"? --Yacht 16:58, Mar 25, 2004 (UTC)

Yes, if you assume that "homosexual behavior" means "the behavior of homosexuals". Not everything's about sex all the time, y'know.-- The Anome 17:32, 25 Mar 2004 (UTC)

wow, the behavior of homosexuals... okay, u've convinced me. --Yacht 17:42, Mar 25, 2004 (UTC)

I'm glad you get it. The three topics are exactly relevant to the word "behavior," which means just about anything humans do. Moncrief 19:40, Mar 25, 2004 (UTC)