Talk:Stephen Ward

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Comments[edit]

http://www.britishpathe.com/video/osteopath-artist appears to show him doing a portrait of Terry Thomas.92.7.149.94 (talk) 21:05, 22 January 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Untitled[edit]

The material that an anonymous user added to this and the Mandy Rice-Davies articles is not, of course, lost for ever, but exists in earlier versions of the page. I have removed it because it was POV and written in a --shall we say, unsuitable? -- style. However, it may contain some useful information, if anyone wants to go back and weed it out. Deb 19:34 28 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Trial and instructions. A defendant may give instructions to counsel during the jury's deliberations, if the jury returns to ask the judge a question.

Full details of the legal "irregularities" are in Geoffrey Robertson "Stephen Ward was innocent, OK?" — Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.148.74.151 (talk) 13:46, 10 December 2013 (UTC)[reply]

Plagiarism[edit]

The sixth paragraph of this entry is plagiarized from an article on the Profumo scandal in BBC's Case Closed file. <http://www.bbc.co.uk/crime/caseclosed/profumo.shtml> --Dithyramb 03:59, 7 Jan 2005 (UTC)

The sixth paragraph reads as follows: "Ward was greatly impressed by the United States. He later commented: "I loved America and Americans, a warm-hearted, open and dynamic people. Their kindness and hospitality made me feel ashamed of the standoffish way the British treat people."

This same quote appears in the Knightley/Kennedy book mentioned elsewhere in this discussion. I'm not sure how you plagiarize a quote. I mean, the quote if it is one is a fact, so how do you steal it? I thought you plagiarized intellectual property. Unless you took a grouping of facts, how could you be stealing intellectual property? Ed Brooks keyman2@att.net —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.210.209.207 (talk) 01:54, 30 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Dead links[edit]

The FBI pdf files at http://foia.fbi.gov/foiaindex/bowtie.htm for Operaton Bowtie will not download. I have tried several times in the last two months. They are either not being made avaialble or there is something technically wrong. Any ideas?

Malangthon 17:44, 24 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I can get them fine. Totnesmartin 23:09, 26 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I recently bought a nude sketch by Stephen Ward at auction, and I have a photograph of it which could be loaded into the "Associations with beautiful girls" web page.

How do I load it?

Brian W London

brianw@DELETEbulldogTHIShomeTEXT.com

If one might inquire, a nude sketch of whom? We know Ward associated with all sorts of high class people. That was what made him interesting--vicarious fame. Most of the sketches he did of these folks were taken out of circulation by agents of their subjects, after Ward's death. So if one survived, it could be worth quite a bit. Ed Brooks keyman2@att.net —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.210.171.142 (talk) 01:47, 28 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Ruth Ellis link[edit]

This site says Ward was linked to Ellis. How about we mention it? Malick78 (talk) 14:20, 3 February 2008 (UTC) Charlton1 (talk) 13:22, 19 February 2008 (UTC)Have added details of Ward's visits to Thursday Club and about his friendship with Ruth Ellis[reply]

Have added a paragraph about Stephen Ward's connection with the actress Diana Dors during the filming of the 1951 comedy Lady Godiva Rides Again. The meeting was detailed in Diana Dors' 1981 autobiography Dors by Diana.Ruth Ellis also had a walk on part as described in Ruth Ellis, My Sister's Secret life. Charlton1 (talk) 20:39, 16 December 2008 (UTC) 213.122.40.156 (talk) 21:05, 15 December 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Missouri[edit]

"He was educated at Highgate School in London and qualified to practice as an osteopath in Missouri." I.e., in the USA (and for that matter in a state not, as far as I know, noted for its close ties to England.) Can anyone clarify the details of his training/"qualification"/certification/licensing/whatever as an osteopath? (Cite, please.) -- 201.37.230.43 (talk) 06:38, 21 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

In the U. S. the only difference between an osteopathic physician and a medical doctor is the title. Apparently the British authorities who refused to honor Ward's credentials did not realize this. 70.233.136.52 (talk) 15:42, 26 September 2013 (UTC)[reply]

4-year course at Kirksville College, in which he also had to qualify in conventional medicine in order to practise osteopathy in USA. (See 'Honeytrap' by Anthony Summers)81.129.67.104 (talk) 18:05, 26 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

"being run by"??[edit]

"It is claimed that Ruth Ellis, the last woman to be hanged in the UK (in 1955), was being run by Stephen Ward ..." Sorry, what does "being run by" mean? Can this please be rephrased to be more comprehensible? -- 201.37.230.43 (talk) 06:43, 21 February 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Yes, clarification would be especially helpful, as both meanings of 'run' could be identified with Ward. The prosecution at his trial smeared him as a pimp. And Ruth Ellis's sister has claimed that he was working for MI5, and could have been running Ruth as a spy, as he apparently ran Christine Keeler, in an attempt to find out atomic secrets from Profumo.81.129.67.104 (talk) 17:29, 26 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

He WAS working for MI5, or at the very least he sincerely and objectively believed he was. The questions directed at him, that he fantasized spy work and the like, are just more of the same--he was being used by the system and the aristocrats, and when they didn't need his services anymore, they threw him to the wolves. See the Knightly/Kennedy book, cited elsewhere in this discussion. Ed Brooks keyman@att.net —Preceding unsigned comment added by 69.99.128.153 (talk) 02:54, 24 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

His own memoirs[edit]

While he was in Brixton Prison, Ward smuggled out some brief memoirs that he never lived to complete. If these are obtainable, it might be good to provide the link. 81.129.67.104 (talk) 18:17, 26 July 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Look at the Knightley/Kennedy book. These are discussed. I believe some survived, but some were purchased or burglarized by high-level individuals who feared exposure. At least this was generally the case. Ed Brooks keyman@att.net —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.210.213.76 (talk) 03:15, 29 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Alternative theories over death[edit]

At the time of my posting this comment there are no references for this section. They smack of conspiracy theory but if they are true they then lack the credibility of any source. Given that it is a highly sensitive matter both politically and personally for any relatives of Ward who may have read it, the article needs some sort of qualifying staement at its commencement. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 114.74.145.23 (talk) 07:10, 31 May 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I removed this entire section recently as being completely unsourced and I think it mentioned a few living persons in, arguably, unflattering contexts. --Demiurge1000 (talk) 13:40, 18 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I don't understand. Scholars and biographers mention persons in whatever context they believe is appropriate. Unflattering references to persons, living or dead, are certainly permitted. If authors were prohibited from making "unflattering" judgements on their subjects, the world of the intellect not to mention free speech and a robust discussion of matters of interest, would suffer a serious blow. Remember, TRUTH is always a defence to a slander/libel accusation. Ed Brooks keyman2@att.net —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.210.213.76 (talk) 03:07, 29 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

"As is often the case..."[edit]

I have moved the following from the article until it can be improved:

As is often the case, there is a story behind this story—it being the framing of Stephen Ward through a combination of police and judicial corruption.^{[citation needed]} Many of those who were involved with the trial^[who?] looked on it as a depressing revelation of the death of the traditional high standards of fair-play for which British justice had been known.^{[citation needed]} Source: An Affair of State, Phillip Knightley and Caroline Kennedy. Atheneum, New York, 1987.

As a potential ~~BLP violation~~ (OK, he's dead, but we need to be accurate), this needs to be cited very precisely, including exact quotes and page numbers from the claimed source. When this is done, it can be restored. -- Filmfluff (talk) 06:09, 18 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

If you want to be accurate, spend the many hours needed to read the Knightley/Kennedy book, check its many citations as far as you feel you need to, and decide for yourself. I did. Ed B

The Wiki encyclopedia is a very helpful source--but the self-important "editors" who gloat over removing the writing of persons who know more than they do are a pain. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.210.171.142 (talk) 01:56, 28 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

I wrote the "As is often the case ...." bit. I am not getting credit, and am not getting paid. How can an anonymous "editor" be allowed to erase my piece, and be heard to demand that I pull out and incorporate citations from the Knightley/Kennedy book. I have referred to the book, and this editor or anyone else can check into it if they question what I have written. Please do not say that this comment is not "signed:-- my name is Ed Brooks, and I can be contacted at keyman2@att.net. Also please do not admonish me not to use my email address. Why not? What is there to be afraid of? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 75.210.123.50 (talk) 01:55, 22 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Owner of 4 Stephen Wards[edit]

I own 4 Wards, all purchased at the "Private auction" days before his death. I am looking to find someone who might be an "expert" that can help me identify an"unidentified young man" in one of them. I know he is of importance because his name was cut out of one of the corners. Personally, I believe he's either Royal, or possibly a lesser nobility, but because of his importance socially or within the Royal Family, his name was "erased" and "Unidentified Young Man" was put on the lot identifier. Any help in this matter would be greatly appreciated.

Scarletm (talk) 10:00, 18 May 2011 (UTC)ScarletM[reply]

Spying and attempted murder[edit]

In Christine Keeler's book 'Secrets and Lies' (which is listed in the article on her as a source) she says very explicitly that Ward :

1. Was a spy who was actively searching for secrets about nuclear warheads to pass to the Russians (page 82).

2. Tried to murder Christine Keeler during a motorboat escapade (page 91).

My questions are : Is Keeler's book a reliable source? If so, why are these shocking revelations about Ward not in the article?

A consensus about adding this information is needed, I think. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 79.94.252.170 (talk) 19:24, 28 December 2015 (UTC) 79.94.252.170 (talk) 19:27, 28 December 2015 (UTC)[reply]

Artworks[edit]

Four of Ward's works were featured in edition 10 of Series 43 of BBC One's Antiques Roadshow in March 2021: [1] (from about 41:30). The sketches were of John Profumo, his wife Valerie Hobson, Yevgeny Ivanov, Mandy Rice-Davies and Christine Keeler. Expert Rupert Maas valued the group at £2,000 - £3,000. Ward was described by Maas as being "no mean artist".Martinevans123 (talk) 21:40, 28 March 2021 (UTC)[reply]