Talk:Ludgate Hill

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Untitled[edit]

Lud - Deen = Lud - dun = Lud - DUNE / DOWN = Lud - HILL = Hill / Mount of Ludd (not valley, which is the opposite of a hill)

Muslim Significance?[edit]

I moved the following here. Any discussion?

"This is significant for Muslims as 'Baab-ul-Lud' or Gate of Lud is where the 'the Messiah'[or second Jesus]will confront the Anti-Christ or 'Dajjal' and defeat him. There are a number of other candidates for Baab-ul-Lud but, none fits the description as to Hadith or Muslim traditions. Christianity was spread by the Romano-British Emperor Constantine. Christian learning and missionary work was pioneered from Britain in the so called early Dark Ages. Missionary Societies in the 1820's started especially in London ......... et cetera."

Et cetera indeed! --Wetman 21:41, 17 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Fair Enough. I still think the significance of Ludgate is important enough to mention within the text of the article. Christianity came to England much before Constantine, in the years following the crucifixion of Jesus if the traditions regarding Joseph of Arimethea are anything to go by. From an Islamic perspective, this is also alluded to in The Holy Quran in the chapter Al Kahf where the word Kahf has been taken to mean the Chalice Well, also known as the shrine of the Lady of the Cape/Cave in Glastonbury. SEMTEX85 (talk) 01:31, 16 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

The reference comes from at least 4 of the canonical books of the Traditions of Prophet Mohammad, they stand second only in importance to The Holy Quran for Muslims and form the basis of the Islamic beliefs. There is a Ludgate in Jerusalem which some believe what the Prophet is likely to have referred to, but I've checked my sources from British folklore (primarily Geoffrey of Monmouth, Bede, Stow's Survey) to Early Christianity to classical Islam, it's definitely Ludgate Hill before St Paul's where it is destined/prophesied to occur. I reckon the foundation was laid in 1924 with the building of London's first mosque by the Ahmadis ;-) There is an historical parallel with the decline and fall of the British Empire and the time of Jesus' first descent and the fall of the Roman Empire. Now, that is cool! SEMTEX85 (talk) 19:31, 20 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

There is not an "Islamic Tradition" that Christ "will encounter and defeat the Antichrist" in London, England. Whoever added this was confusing the Gate of Lud in (historical) Palestine/(modern) Israel with Ludgate in London.Jimaingram 04:22, 8 December 2009 (UTC) —Preceding unsigned comment added by Jimaingram (talk • contribs)

The prophecy of the Holy Prophet Mohummad Mustafa (ﷺ) is in following Hadith [Tradition]: Al-Nawwas b. Sim’an al-Kilabi said: The Apostle (ﷺ) of Allah mentioned the Dajjal [Anti-Christ] saying: If he comes forth while I am among you I shall be the one who shall dispute with him on your behalf, but if he comes forth, while I am not among you, a man must dispute on his own behalf, and Allah will take my place in looking after every Muslim. Those of you who live up to his time should recite the opening verses of Sura al-Kahf for they are your protection from his trial. We asked: How long will he remain on the Earth? He replied: 40 days, one like a year, one like a month, one like a week, and the rest of his days like yours. We asked: Apostle (ﷺ) of Allah, will one day’s prayer suffice us, in this day which will be like a year? He replied: No, you must make an estimate of it’s extent. Then Jesus son of Mary will descend at the white minaret to the east of Damascus. He will then catch him at the gate of Ludd and kill him. (Abu Dawud 1600: 4307, et al).

According to the historian Geoffery of Monmouth (who also, incidentally, relates this place to the return of the soul-perturbed King Arthur, in peril, in the chapter on the Prophecies of Merlin), author of Historia Reggum Britanniae (c. 1136 ACE) London was named by King Llud as Caer Llud ('City of Lud') at approx. 66 BCE. During its subsequent immediate Roman conquest its name was Romanised to Londonium. No better extant documentary source exists for its derivation. Ludgate, in London, is one of the old gates of the city. At Ludgate Hill is the world famous Cathedral, St. Paul’s. There is more but this much should suffice. It is a prophetic tradition that prophecies are carried out to the word as much as is possible (as though these rituals carry a mystical significance) in fulfillment of their spiritual ones. SEMTEX85 (talk) 04:30, 27 March 2010 (UTC)[reply]

London stone[edit]

I have deleted this line:

"Not far away, in Cannon Street, is the Roman or pre-Roman London Stone, from which measurements to London have been taken." because it is "too far away", in my opinion. Also it's isn't Roman! Ogg 10:32, 12 May 2007 (UTC)[reply]

How High[edit]

Those of us who do not live in London have no idea how high this hill is. In San Francisco, California the highest hill is at 279 m. or 938 ft. so I assume that Ludgate Hill is that high. Nick Beeson (talk) 21:04, 2 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Erm, it's a few metres high at most, rising to a dizzying 17m above sea level or so. And that's not a joke. David (talk) 21:20, 2 September 2010 (UTC)[reply]

Ludgate Hill[edit]

Could it be possible to find an old picture of the three ancient hills of London? Ludgate Hill, Tower Hill and Cornhill. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Mcmaldo (talk • contribs) 18:54, 9 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Etymology[edit]

I am astonished that someone has confidently written that Lud is derived from Lid or Street?? implying that ludgate means Lid street or even Street Street? Sounds like complete nonesense. Seeing as London is derived from Lud don ie, King lud's town everyone I know would assume that Lud Gate simply means King Lud's Street. 94.31.12.194 (talk) 09:55, 5 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Where does the article say that? And why are the sources in the article wrong that give a different etymology? Dougweller (talk) 11:38, 5 August 2011 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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Hercules statue ref (1) Ludgate statues Ref (2) Leigh Hunt's description 

spam, 404 and spam

164.215.0.189 (talk) 07:57, 19 June 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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1970 photo might be much later?[edit]

That's an '80s looking BMW in the photo surely... i wager the photo is 1978-1980. - maxrspct ping me 11:21, 9 November 2021 (UTC)[reply]

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